Today’s warm up sketch was of Alycia (since she’s been a focal point lately and I was planning on taking another pass at that disguise after I deep dive into that Pinterest board). I’m really beginning to like these simple portraits. I blame Doyce.
author: Mike
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6124991
Nice. There’s a load of sadness and experience beyond what any 17yo should have in that portrait.
author: *** Dave H.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6125137
Tried some clean up on my previous design of Charade. I’m assuming that her power set is going to be “weapons and martial expertise” so I’m leaving those generic holsters there until we know exactly what form that will take. I really liked that look of the fur-lined hoodie from the Redeemed’s playbook so I tried a shorter jacket with a fur collar. If I wear writing a Menagerie tv show, her first episode would involve her stealing a motorcycle and the rider’s jacket to catch up with the villain of the week, only to keep it for the rest of the show.
Not 100% sold on it yet (I’d really like to try out another design but I’ve been a little stuck), but I assume Dave might have some opinions here.
author: Mike
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6136246
So I already had intentions toward Alycia and a Motorcycle, so there’s a fit there.
I’m kind of liking that overcoat look – something with enough freedom for acrobats (and enough flare to make them look interesting). So I’m liking (3) best here.
Alycia will likely have dual pistols (probably with, sigh, obligatory non-fatal ammo, gel rounds, that sort of thing), until she can get back to tinkering on some hypertech gloves. (She may still keep the guns at that point.)
author: *** Dave H.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6136600
As an in-universe civilian, I’d look at any of these and be like “that person is a villain”. As a player, I think they all look great. Everything below the neck says “I’m going to rob a Wall Street trading firm with my gang of disposable Eastern European henchmen”, but the helmet softens it up.
If either of you are looking for suggestions, here’s a few at random.
author: Bill G.
url: Community Forums: Art Thread | Roll20: Online virtual tabletop
Bill G. said:
As an in-universe civilian, I’d look at any of these and be like “that person is a villain”.
Alycia is not unaware or unappreciative of that implication.
As a player, I think they all look great. Everything below the neck says “I’m going to rob a Wall Street trading firm with my gang of disposable Eastern European henchmen”, but the helmet softens it up.
Yup.
I’m not completely sold on the hood / helm – it makes sense from an anonymity standpoint, and the juxtaposition of whimsy a a very nice touch, but it does look more than a bit uncomfortable.
I’m also willing to engage in a bit of comic book license and acknowledge the need for disguise while not being overly realistic about what that entails. More than a domino mask, certainly, but …
If either of you are looking for suggestions, here’s a few at random.
- The coat is breakaway at the waist, going from trench coat to jacket, and can be reattached. The detached portion might function as a parachute, shield (made of fibers that harden when electrified?), optical camouflage netting, or some other handy device.
- The coat is Batman’s utility belt. She can grab smoke bombs, gadgets, or whatever from inner pockets. And/or there’s patches on the outside, containing useful gizmos, traps for anyone stupid enough to grab her, etc.
Makes sense, to the extent that she has time / opportunity / materials for gadgeteering, that the outfit give her great places to stash reasonable generic gadgetry. Ditto on the opportunities to do stuff with specialized ammo.
- If she’s not too worried about it being grabbed, her long hair might need to flow out of the helmet into a ponytail or something. To me, it helps us peek under the disguise a bit, and remind us that there’s a regular person in there, without giving away just who it is.
I look on that level of tactical vulnerability as story element – i.e., if I do a poor job on a roll where the opposition finds something to take advantage of, if not the ponytail then it will be something else. 
author: *** Dave H.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6139563
https://www.racked.com/2018/3/1/17020670/clothes-c…
Clothes in Comic Books Have Gotten a Lot Better
author: Bill G.
url: Community Forums: Art Thread | Roll20: Online virtual tabletop
There’s been some good stuff in comics design work mentioned for street and young heroes (Batgirl, Spider-woman being two good examples, though I wish they’d shown a bit more). If you look at the “look” to date gorgeous the Menagerie, we have one classic hero, one anime style, a gal in antebellum dress, something cosmic and weird, and a guy in a black shirt.
So we certainly have room for a variety of possibilities for Alycia, something that distinctly not the skin-tight suit, trying to make a balance between freedom of movement, protection, and something that projects some sort of style and “brand”.
author: *** Dave H.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6139982
Saw this earlier, wanted to chime in, but sadly “oh, we’ll just stop by Ikea to buy this one thing” quickly turns into an all day (and night with the construction) event.
Anyway, I get the “this doesn’t look like a hero” vibe: I totally designed it around that very idea.
The biggest conceit with all of superhero comics is the costume and that people willing go out in them. In fact, here’s all of that boiled down to a couple of panels from one of my favorite comics from the 2000’s.
And I don’t think Alycia both understands that and (even if she did) doesn’t falls in line with that sort of thinking–yet. She’s not here to help people. She’s here to do bad things to worse people. So she does have a lot of that look of “I’m going to rob a Wall Street trading firm with my gang of disposable Eastern European henchmen.” (I love this line, BTW. Going to steal it at some point.)
And yeah, the helmet doesn’t look the most comfortable (then again neither does the Red Hood’s, but he’s kind of nuts since he keeps explosives in it NEXT TO HIS FREAKIN SKULL), it was just the first thing I thought of when the name Charade came up, but I’m of course open to alternate suggestions. I don’t think I’ve zeroed in on a good mental image of Alycia post-turn in to AEGIS and now joining the team. Might need to just deep-dive into some basic sketches and barf forth designs.
Finally, loved that article from Racked. That final image of the redesign of Spider-Woman is from Kristafer Anka (oddly, not directly credited under the image like the Wada one was), who does some amazing costume designs and I’d almost completely forgotten about until I recognized the redesign. Might need to crib some ideas from some of those designs.
author: Mike
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6140111
Mike said:
Anyway, I get the “this doesn’t look like a hero” vibe: I totally designed it around that very idea.
I’m cool with that - I just think it affects the how and when of her acquisition of it, and whether AEGIS’s PR team got a veto or not. 
The biggest conceit with all of superhero comics is the costume and that people willing go out in them.
Mr. Big as usual has two things to say here, both in keeping with his pretty pragmatic universe - wear armor until you don’t need it any more. After that, heroes can wear bright colorful stuff because they’re more bulletproof than the civilians they want to protect, so bad guys will shoot at them, while villains wear the same to keep the public at least slightly sympathetic, and not just have them evaluated as faceless terrorists worthy of being shot in the head.
Charade as depicted here seems to have taken this kind of advice to heart, as that costume definitely looks armored in the right places. It’s not the minimalist coat-and-mask of Darker Than Black’s Hei (who is basically a Villain Protagonist), and it makes a statement without being impractical about it.
And yeah, the helmet doesn’t look the most comfortable (then again neither does the Red Hood’s, but he’s kind of nuts since he keeps explosives in it NEXT TO HIS FREAKIN SKULL), it was just the first thing I thought of when the name Charade came up, but I’m of course open to alternate suggestions.
Better helmet than headshot. And I was reminded of Young Justice’s Stealth-tech. Can, for example, the whole costume switch (now or later on) from red-black to just black, with the white of the helmet “sliding away” or being re-pigmented to an all-black look?
This is more a thing for Dave than Mike, but there’s a lot of “reminders of the past” for morally compromised characters like Black Widow, Killmonger, etc., sometimes becoming actual scars or marks. Natasha’s comment about “red on my ledger” reminds me of the red coloration here, as well as the usual associations of red with blood, anger, etc. Is it possible that she thinks of herself as having a “debt” to pay off of some kind, whether she admits it openly or not, and uses her costume as a very low-key way of reminding herself? If so, each good deed might come with a repaint of part of the outfit, giving her a more patchwork look.
author: Bill G.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6140189
Bill G. said:
The biggest conceit with all of superhero comics is the costume and that people willing go out in them.
Mr. Big as usual has two things to say here, both in keeping with his pretty pragmatic universe - wear armor until you don’t need it any more. After that, heroes can wear bright colorful stuff because they’re more bulletproof than the civilians they want to protect, so bad guys will shoot at them, while villains wear the same to keep the public at least slightly sympathetic, and not just have them evaluated as faceless terrorists worthy of being shot in the head.
Bill, every now and again I forget that you’ve written a lot of stuff that I enjoyed and appreciated. Hell, this was one my first introductions to Fate. Don’t think I’ve ever said this before, but thanks for all that.
That last bit also gives me some thoughts on this. I might need to go back and reread some the cut scenes (full disclosure, far more than I’d like I see the email update for, don’t have enough time to read it, forget about it, come back and speed read through when I do remember–generally when there’s like ten replies to it) and see if any of the story elements might help inspire some designs here too. Also, interested to hear what Dave has to say on this end.
author: Mike
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6140241
Dave (who is down with the flu, but thinks this post important enough to draaaaag himself to an actual keyboard) has to say:
1. Ha! Literally (re)read that panel yesterday, from Ellis’ Thunderbolts series, which is typical Ellis high-concept crazytown but quite good. The application here had occurred to me, but I fully agree that Alycia is (ironically) not into whatever she’s doing for “the people,” but for herself, so going with a scarier vibe, to the extent that it kind of freaks out people, is A-OK with her.
2. Alycia as a gun-and-gadget type isn’t invulnerable, so some sort of armor is necessary. That said, a lot of what she does is around movement, so it needs to be flexible, light-weight, and mobile. She hasn’t gotten around to inventing a personal force field (yet), and powered armor is, in her experience, high potential for things to go wrong. Her home school training has taught her (painfully) what being hit in an armor plate with weapons feels like, so she appreciates the need, but she finds more value in figuring out how not to be a target.
(Alycia is probably not a lead-the-charge type; one of many reasons why she never had a lot of success with those Eastern European / Columbian / Tong / Yakuza mooks wearing Chin’s livery.)
3. Fine Mr. Big entries, as always.
4. Even if kitted out by AEGIS, she will probably, pragmatically, adjust the wardrobe in the field, probably downward to more freedom of movement (which is both a practical consideration and an emotional metaphor for her).
Or, looked at another way, the Punisher doesn’t do a lot in the way of armor. On the other hand, the Punisher gets the snot kicked out him every other issue, so maybe that’s not a good example.
author: *** Dave H.
url: Community Forums: Art Thread | Roll20: Online virtual tabletop
I tell you what - we rewatched the first Avengers movie last night and I was getting a STRRRRRONG Alycia-reformed vibe off Black Widow’s “got red in my ledger” theme.
And, not for nothing, there’s a fair amount of overlap in her gear-set with Alycia.
Just dropping that in there to mix things up.
I like the idea of the hair coming out the back of the mask. Again, reminds me of YJ’s Cheshire.
author: Doyce T.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6142913
I actually watched about 3/4 of Avenger this afternoon (until the Blu Ray overheated, which kind of sucked), and, yes, there are those parallels.
And differences, to be sure. Fundamental of which, Natasha had more time as an adult working for the Red Room (or whichever version of BW the movies are using). She is able to approach her life as a state-run killer from a more adult perspective than a 17yo (who perceives it through that This Is The Worst Thing Ever, I Am The Worst Person Ever teen filter). Tasha has at least another decade on Alycia to have both committed greater crimes and have more perspective on the crimes she’d committed.
(If anything, Tasha could be Alycia in another 10-15 years – saved by Jason and the kindness of others, but still dealing with the “red in her ledger.”)
I really am trying not to do the Tasha thing with the serial numbers filed off, just because it’s such an obvious cliche, but there will be aspects that are similar. Esp. since I love the character and portrayal so much.
At the very least, regardless, no cat-suits unzipped to the decolletage.
author: *** Dave H.
url: Community Forums: Art Thread | Roll20: Online virtual tabletop
So, played around with some more designs. Left them grey scale so I can play around with color schemes later. Seven is currently my favorite (mostly because it was a “best of” all the previous designs).
author: Mike
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6143668
Fun stuff.
1. Nice variation on previous themes, I think – is the butt cape part of the jacket, or something attached at the waist? I’m good with the “bandit’s mask” face cover. For purposes of the comic, it’s an arguable disguise without being impossible for the reader to recognize her.
2. A little ninja for my taste. The slung belts don’t work in conjunction with acrobatics.
3. Very martial artsy, perhaps too much so, but a fun character.
4. The coat seems constrictiong,
5. I like that you can see her expression in this one, though not perhaps the shorter hair. Again, the coat seems constricting.
6. The fur-collared (?) greatcoat look. Not much to be said pro or con the basics. With mirror shades, no doubt.
7. Seems a bit fiddly in its various bits; I’m not altogether certain what’s going on with the parts.
author: *** Dave H.
url: Community Forums: Art Thread | Roll20: Online virtual tabletop
So the butt cape–I’ve seen it in a couple of places and have no idea what purpose it serves (other than changing the silhouette of the character). Looks cool though.
Yeah, in retrospect, seven is rather busy. Playing around with different hair styles was just to see if something hit a chord. I highly doubt Alycia’s actually going to do anything other than pull the hair back into a bun or ponytail, but one can always try things out.
I have a couple more designs that have come to mind after flipping through some of my old Mutants and Masterminds books (I could have sworn the body armor from 1, 6, and 7 was based on something I saw in one of those books, but I couldn’t find it) but I doubt I’ll be able to get to those today.
author: Mike
url: Community Forums: Art Thread | Roll20: Online virtual tabletop
So I did manage to have some free time, but oh did I decide to have some fun with the design. Also, went for a fixed width brush (like a ball-point pen) instead of my normal inking brush, mostly so I didn’t worry too much about fine detail yet. Not bad, since I churned these out in like half an hour. I’ll have to try that more often for quick, simple design work.
1 is me trying to salvage the split sides coat from 7 in the previous batch. Oddly enough, this makes me think of an archer character more than someone like Alycia, which is odd.
2 and 3 delve into that cat suit aesthetic, which sadly make her look like the Baroness from the GI Joe live action movies. Not a fan but figured someone might enjoy pieces of this.
4 tries to pull some of those elements out into something more with a gunfighter style (trying to salvage a bit from 2 on the previous batch). Not bad, but not great.
5 is me just having fun with the backstory and while I love it, I could never see it actually getting used. It would require maximum petulance from Alycia towards Agent Parker and AEGIS in general, and would probably lead the funniest of after-action reports.
Parker: “So, you broke into an AEGIS locker room–”
Alycia: “Well, you don’t expect me to go into the field without equipment.”
P: “–You stole and damaged my clothes–”
A: “If any of the rest of your team wore clothes in my size, I probably would have chose them instead. Martinez at least tries to be fashionable within the dress code requirements.”
P: “–You defaced AEGIS equipment with an anarchy symbol–”
A: “I thought you might want some plausible deniability.”
P: “–And you stole Agent Grogan’s sidearms.”
A: “I think we can all agree I did us a favor by doing that. He’s not exactly a model agent.”
P: “Well, let’s go on to the mission itself…”
author: Mike
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6146133
Mike said:
So the butt cape–I’ve seen it in a couple of places and have no idea what purpose it serves (other than changing the silhouette of the character). Looks cool though.
In the late, still-mourned City of Heroes, when trench coats were introduced they got the nickname butt capes, as the lower, below the waist part was the only ting that really articulated when you ran.
Yeah, in retrospect, seven is rather busy. Playing around with different hair styles was just to see if something hit a chord. I highly doubt Alycia’s actually going to do anything other than pull the hair back into a bun or ponytail, but one can always try things out.
Most likely. Father was big on appearances. Alycia, in reaction, not so much. Though she understands the value of disguise and camouflage and sending a message through visuals, and all of that. She just doesn’t see the need for it … the rest of the time.
I have a couple more designs that have come to mind after flipping through some of my old Mutants and Masterminds books (I could have sworn the body armor from 1, 6, and 7 was based on something I saw in one of those books, but I couldn’t find it) but I doubt I’ll be able to get to those today.
No rush.
I really am enjoying all the ideas.
It’s important to remember (for me, too) that the idea of a “costume,” for Alycia, is something new. Disguises, mission gear, work-out clothes, overalls and a t-shirt while working under the DeathMobile, whatever – that’s normal. Something to strike inspiration or fear into the hearts of others? Not so much.
author: *** Dave H.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6146197
Mike said:
1 is me trying to salvage the split sides coat from 7 in the previous batch. Oddly enough, this makes me think of an archer character more than someone like Alycia, which is odd
Yeah, a little too skirt-like for Alycia.
2 and 3 delve into that cat suit aesthetic, which sadly make her look like the Baroness from the GI Joe live action movies. Not a fan but figured someone might enjoy pieces of this.
Well, there is something to be said for the Baroness look.
4 tries to pull some of those elements out into something more with a gunfighter style (trying to salvage a bit from 2 on the previous batch). Not bad, but not great.
Maybe a little too gunfighter – the vest, the holster, the bandit’s mask.
5 is me just having fun with the backstory and while I love it, I could never see it actually getting used. It would require maximum petulance from Alycia towards Agent Parker and AEGIS in general, and would probably lead the funniest of after-action reports.
Now that’s comedy.
Actually, it’s got a nice quirkiness to it. Maybe a bit too quirky, but fun. And the accompanying vignette was nicely played.
author: *** Dave H.
url: https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/6146251
